Objective proof?

[coach belly]

The "stop loss" phrase never even enters into my head.

It is clear that nothing enters into your head.

Everybody funny, now you funny too.

[jbjb]

I always say that if cats come over the top with the claim then they should stand the scrutinies, hey hey.

Let's start with you. Prove you have cashews and Guinness!

[monet]

jbjb...you, and your penny-ante bullshit, are what monet has identified as fake.

If you are the real deal, then prove it, like monet does.

You are all talk (type)...100% bullshit.

Put up or shut up, loser.

jbjb is pretty good at staying mum.
I wish he would show me how to get those 25 and 50% winners.
I've seen him post some nickel vulture pictures but you know I tend to believe he is out there killing it.

Listen, I told you all I was going to Fucking Prove to you all that I could beat Parlays.
Boz and some of you all scoffed.
Called me a degenerate.
Wah... Felling Hurt.
Now who is laughing?
And guess what... we ain't done yet.
We just getting started!
The APs get scared of me because they have no clue how much I know and how much I will post about online.
Scarred!
Or is it Scared?
tableplay likes me at least.
Always been nice to me and in my corner.
Song Reco.... Sorry it's in the wrong thread buddy!
I'm not your Buddy, Pal.
Oh yeah, I'm not your Friend, Buddy!

[MisterV]

It is clear Alan is jealous of those who made it gambling or otherwise he wouldn't have spent so much of his time trying to chase the big win and catch it with a stop-loss it? (or however it works in his head)

"Jealous?"

Pretty strong word, with emotional connotations.

I doubt he's jealous; Alan may have a touch of envy when he sees a big score, but that is normal.

You see, recreational gamblers such as Alan and myself do not have to win in either the short or long run in order to feel that we've enjoyed ourselves gambling.

We expect to lose, budget accordingly, and savor wins when they occur.

Alan may have bet higher amounts when his income was greater but he seems to have scaled it down to face his new reality, which is as it should be.

[jbjb]

jbjb...you, and your penny-ante bullshit, are what monet has identified as fake.

If you are the real deal, then prove it, like monet does.

You are all talk (type)...100% bullshit.

Put up or shut up, loser.

jbjb is pretty good at staying mum.
I wish he would show me how to get those 25 and 50% winners.
I've seen him post some nickel vulture pictures but you know I tend to believe he is out there killing it.

Listen, I told you all I was going to Fucking Prove to you all that I could beat Parlays.
Boz and some of you all scoffed.
Called me a degenerate.
Wah... Felling Hurt.
Now who is laughing?
And guess what... we ain't done yet.
We just getting started!
The APs get scared of me because they have no clue how much I know and how much I will post about online.
Scarred!
Or is it Scared?
tableplay likes me at least.
Always been nice to me and in my corner.
Song Reco.... Sorry it's in the wrong thread buddy!
I'm not your Buddy, Pal.
Oh yeah, I'm not your Friend, Buddy!

I haven't wasted time on UX in months. 98% table games now and the rest some slots.

[Alan Mendelson]

It is clear Alan is jealous of those who made it gambling or otherwise he wouldn't have spent so much of his time trying to chase the big win and catch it with a stop-loss it? (or however it works in his head)

"Jealous?"

Pretty strong word, with emotional connotations.

I doubt he's jealous; Alan may have a touch of envy when he sees a big score, but that is normal.

You see, recreational gamblers such as Alan and myself do not have to win in either the short or long run in order to feel that we've enjoyed ourselves gambling.

We expect to lose, budget accordingly, and savor wins when they occur.

Alan may have bet higher amounts when his income was greater but he seems to have scaled it down to face his new reality, which is as it should be.

You are a very smart man, MrV.

[soxfan]

This stops-loss/stops-wins stuff is bulls-shits, if a cat got an actual winnings style of play then the more he play the more he gonna win. The stops-loss/stops-win stuff is for chickens-shits, scared, loser recreational player, hey hey.

[coach belly]

I've seen him post some nickel vulture pictures but you know I tend to believe he is out there killing it.

Yeah, he's killing it $8 per day...murder by a thousand paper cuts.

How's that nickel VP working out for you?

[jbjb]

BTW, I have that pedophile CoachBelly on ignore. He shouldn't even bother.

[coach belly]

BTW, I have CoachBelly on ignore.

No bother, just file it under "can't stand the heat".

[smurgerburger]

I'm still stuck on how inane Alan's claim is that he pities people that don't have employer-sponsored pensions.

A pension is a financial product that has a certain present value. One person could have vastly more wealth than another even if the latter has a pension and the former doesn't. You might as well pity people that don't own municipal bonds or crypto or credit default swaps.

[accountinquestion]

It is clear Alan is jealous of those who made it gambling or otherwise he wouldn't have spent so much of his time trying to chase the big win and catch it with a stop-loss it? (or however it works in his head)

"Jealous?"

Pretty strong word, with emotional connotations.

I doubt he's jealous; Alan may have a touch of envy when he sees a big score, but that is normal.

You see, recreational gamblers such as Alan and myself do not have to win in either the short or long run in order to feel that we've enjoyed ourselves gambling.

We expect to lose, budget accordingly, and savor wins when they occur.

Alan may have bet higher amounts when his income was greater but he seems to have scaled it down to face his new reality, which is as it should be.

There are all types of gamblers. There are recreational gamblers and there are problem gamblers who are still "recreational".

I suppose you're right, probably more envy. Jealousy still fits. Regardless, a certain bitterness to people who win gambling.

IIRC someone in his family came online complaining about his gambling issues. Has anything similar happened to you? If not then I'd suggest you not make the analogy.

If you're really a recreational gambler, you don't have a stop-loss. You have X amount of $$ and if you lose it, you lose it. You don't need a stop-loss because you understand the concept of a fucking BUDGET.

[accountinquestion]

I'm still stuck on how inane Alan's claim is that he pities people that don't have employer-sponsored pensions.

A pension is a financial product that has a certain present value. One person could have vastly more wealth than another even if the latter has a pension and the former doesn't. You might as well pity people that don't own municipal bonds or crypto or credit default swaps.

My understanding is pensions can also go bust. In fact there are many states who are potentially facing this issue.

[kewlJ]

This stops-loss/stops-wins stuff is bulls-shits, if a cat got an actual winnings style of play then the more he play the more he gonna win. The stops-loss/stops-win stuff is for chickens-shits, scared, loser recreational player, hey hey.

Soxfan, I never knew what the "hey hey" is at the end of every post, but the rest of your post is exactly right. Players playing with an advantage (AP's) whether playing for a living or playing recreationally, have no reason for any kind of artificial stop "goal". Every round we play is money in the long run. We want to get as many rounds or trials in as we can. THAT is what the long run is.

Now obviously we aren't going to play continually. Play for the day is going to end. But that decision should never really be based on some kind of stop target. That decision should be because we are tired of playing for the day, or because conditions are no longer favorable. The only exception to that for me, is based on the logistics of bankroll. As a blackjack player playing to a six figure bankroll, I am not going to carry that entire bankroll on me daily. That is way too much risk. So I carry what is called a trip bankroll, or daily play bankroll that will in most cases suffice for that day or trip.

Now every once in while I will experience daily or trip losses that either wipe out that daily or trip bankroll or diminish it to the point that it is not enough to play without replenishing, of which I have several options. Sometimes when this happens well into the day, I will decide that is a good place to stop rather than run back home or to a bank to replenish. THAT is about as close as I come to a stop limit. But it really isn't. I am not stopping because I don't have the funds to continue, I am stopping because it is a convenient place to stop for the day rather than run around wherever I have to replenish.

But other than that kind of situation caused by the logistics of carrying funds safely, a player playing with an mathematical edge should never stop because of some artificial limit. It should be that he is tired of playing for that day or conditions are no longer favorable. Stop limits based on win or loss limits are for losing -EV players. Period!

[MisterV]

IIRC someone in his family came online complaining about his gambling issues. Has anything similar happened to you?

No, unlike Alan my son has not yet posted on this board in an attempt to make private business public.

But yeah, both my wife and my son have some concern about my losses...but they never complain about my wins.

My son is the most annoying; whenever I tell him I'm going to gamble he seems unsupportive and against the idea, probably believing "he's gambling away my inheritance."

LOL...in fact, I am.

[tableplay]

tableplay likes me at least.
Always been nice to me and in my corner.
Song Reco.... Sorry it's in the wrong thread buddy!
I'm not your Buddy, Pal.
Oh yeah, I'm not your Friend, Buddy!

Quite true sir, you're a nice person (I would bet on Danny saying the same thing). Anyway, I had enough years in as a working stiff to qualify for medicare and SS benefits later on. I doubt I will be able to get the super-premium health insurance that Blackhole has unless I decide I really want to draw myself down, but nothing's perfect. As you and JBJB wrote, for some of us freedom is the most important thing - I could tell even when I was a nine-to-fiver that it wasn't for me and eventually my natural inclinations (live free or die) started to dominate and that was that. You'll (the lurkers reading VCT that are not currently full-time APs that is) know it if you're that personality type - it will just fit like a glove.

[redietz]

Gambling is your only income. That's sad.

Why "sad?"

It's sad that he cant take off. He can't let an employer pay for his retirement. He cant have an employer pay for his health insurance. He doesn't get sick pay.

And he's DEPENDENT on a stop loss strategy. He knows that he cant blow thru his bankroll because his bankroll is his job. He must conserve wins and he must limit losses.

Unlike someone with a job he cant replenish his gambling bankroll with his next paycheck.

Frankly he's the poster child for why a stop loss program is essential. If he loses too much he loses his chance to work and his chance to win.

I don't get this post at all.

KewlJ can take off any time he wants. He doesn't get paid, but theoretically he's saved up the same as if he had unemployment insurance. Saving like that takes discipline.

For most of these APs, the APing IS their job. They just cut out the middle man and handle their insurance and unemployment themselves.

APing can dry up any time. True dat, but so can any business. And it's rare for someone to "age out" of APing, although I can see that happening in poker.

As far as a "stop loss program," that's gobbledygook. If you play properly bankrolled and adjust play to the status of the bankroll, it'll take a minor miracle to bankrupt you. I don't know to what extent people consider me an AP, but I work on percent of profit. I have losing years. That's as in I make no money in total for 365 days. Zero. I have to be able to handle that. If someone playing blackjack is playing properly for the size of their bankroll, and they are in danger of bankruptcy, it's a minor miracle or the rules have changed or they've joined ZK on tribal land or they are blowing money on other forms of gambling. It isn't going to happen.

What Alan said can be applied to private investigators and independent realtors and football coaches.

[Alan Mendelson]

IIRC someone in his family came online complaining about his gambling issues

That was my son... blaming me because his business went into bankruptcy... and he didnt file tax returns for three years... and he didnt send to the IRS his employees' withholding (a criminal offense)... and his half-million dollar house that he couldn't afford went into foreclosure... and he had his car repoed... and his one year old son (my grandson) was diagnosed with autism... and it was all MY fault.

And like a good father I kept my mouth shut and let him blame everything on me because I couldn't bail him out.

Sometimes fathers do that... they shut up and accept the blame because they love their children.

By the way he got one of those massive pandemic SBA loans so now he's rolling in cash and he has an RV and two Teslas and kept his house and started a new business.

Yeah... it was all my fault.

[Alan Mendelson]

Why "sad?"

It's sad that he cant take off. He can't let an employer pay for his retirement. He cant have an employer pay for his health insurance. He doesn't get sick pay.

And he's DEPENDENT on a stop loss strategy. He knows that he cant blow thru his bankroll because his bankroll is his job. He must conserve wins and he must limit losses.

Unlike someone with a job he cant replenish his gambling bankroll with his next paycheck.

Frankly he's the poster child for why a stop loss program is essential. If he loses too much he loses his chance to work and his chance to win.

I don't get this post at all.

KewlJ can take off any time he wants. He doesn't get paid, but theoretically he's saved up the same as if he had unemployment insurance. Saving like that takes discipline.

For most of these APs, the APing IS their job. They just cut out the middle man and handle their insurance and unemployment themselves.

APing can dry up any time. True dat, but so can any business. And it's rare for someone to "age out" of APing, although I can see that happening in poker.

As far as a "stop loss program," that's gobbledygook. If you play properly bankrolled and adjust play to the status of the bankroll, it'll take a minor miracle to bankrupt you. I don't know to what extent people consider me an AP, but I work on percent of profit. I have losing years. That's as in I make no money in total for 365 days. Zero. I have to be able to handle that. If someone playing blackjack is playing properly for the size of their bankroll, and they are in danger of bankruptcy, it's a minor miracle or the rules have changed or they've joined ZK on tribal land or they are blowing money on other forms of gambling. It isn't going to happen.

What Alan said can be applied to private investigators and independent realtors and football coaches.

Redietz all you did here was talk about money management and quitting when ahead is part of good money management.

Or... are you going to say it's better to lose?

I can't believe people are fighting over "quitting when ahead."

[coach belly]

Sometimes fathers do that.

You're talking over Boz's and AIQ's heads.

Children? What’s that?

Those two limp dicks are poster boys for natural selection,
Boz is all about finding and sharing photos of Chrissy Mitchell.