Professional Sportsbetting

[mickeycrimm]

And finally, I'm really, really busy, but so nobody misses my Axelwolf responses, when I get a chance, I'll start up a thread explaining what is really very funny about some of Axelwolf's comments.

He just hasn't thought things through.

Are you busy contacting Munchkin?

[mickeycrimm]

And finally, I'm really, really busy, but so nobody misses my Axelwolf responses, when I get a chance, I'll start up a thread explaining what is really very funny about some of Axelwolf's comments.

He just hasn't thought things through.

If he believes you actually turned down clients (money) then yes he hasn’t thought things through. Where was your boiler room?

[redietz]

And finally, I'm really, really busy, but so nobody misses my Axelwolf responses, when I get a chance, I'll start up a thread explaining what is really very funny about some of Axelwolf's comments.

He just hasn't thought things through.

If he believes you actually turned down clients (money) then yes he hasn’t thought things through. Where was your boiler room?

Go ahead, mickey. Use every contact you have, every social and gambling acquaintance and friend. I was out there in public way more than you or any of your compadres.

I was on newsstands in Playbook for decades. Find one account of me being a "boiler room operator." Find one person who says I didn't always, for 45 years, conduct myself with the highest ethical standards. Call anyone and everyone you know.

Call Marc Lawrence or the people running every monitoring outfit. Call Gamblers' Book Club and track down the old Whos' Who in Sports Gambling, which was published there. Call Mr. Walters. Or dial up "Anthony Curtis" and ask what he's heard.

Go ahead and find one chink in my moral armor.

Or just continue to defame and libel me on a public forum with zero information to back up your libelous comments. That's who you are and what you are about. It's actually ha-ha funny. It shines a spotlight on your credibility.

[coach belly]

I do have a conscience and want to sleep at night so I'm not waiting to get into a situation where I'm offering something that's BS and there's no way the guys paying have +EV above the 10k they are paying.

You could avoid that situation by not offering something that's BS.

But I'm not sure that EV is a factor with his clients.

They only offer to pay him if his opinion is correct.

I'm not certain that they are even required to pay him.

[redietz]

I do have a conscience and want to sleep at night so I'm not waiting to get into a situation where I'm offering something that's BS and there's no way the guys paying have +EV above the 10k they are paying.

They only offer to pay him if his opinion is correct.

Maybe you slept through that part of the deal.

Wise up.

Reading is a lost "AP" art.

[AxelWolf]

All the good/successful sports bettors I know don't take on clients.

Why wouldn't they...aren't clients essentially a freeroll?

When it comes to investing clients one should only be getting a very small percentage, unless they are unethicly fleecing their clients. That wouldn't fit the narrative of Integrity Sports.

Let us assume a tout(for lack of a better term) is making his clients 10% via handicapping (That seems unrealistically high, but we will go with it).
let's assume he gets in 2 million worth of bets for the year on behalf of his clients and let's assume he gets 10% of that. That means he would be only making 20k for the year.

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year. Why would one want to give up 180k? I can understand if a guy is first starting out and he needs to build up a bankroll.

Red said himself, AP Sports betting dwarfs most other forms of AP because it's highly scalable. If you have had years of a proven track record, there's very little reason you would need or want investors for long since a meager bankroll should be growing year after year using Kelly.

There are probably some benefits to having investors beyond the freeroll aspect, but I highly doubt that would make up for that 90% you are giving up.

[AxelWolf]

I do have a conscience and want to sleep at night so I'm not waiting to get into a situation where I'm offering something that's BS and there's no way the guys paying have +EV above the 10k they are paying.

You could avoid that situation by not offering something that's BS.

But I'm not sure that EV is a factor with his clients.

They only offer to pay him if his opinion is correct.

I'm not certain that they are even required to pay him.

I dont think they are paying per pick. I think they give/gave him money. He bets or has them bet and they give him a percentage of the wins.

[redietz]

All the good/successful sports bettors I know don't take on clients.

Why wouldn't they...aren't clients essentially a freeroll?

When it comes to investing clients one should only be getting a very small percentage, unless they are unethicly fleecing their clients. That wouldn't fit the narrative of Integrity Sports.

Let us assume a tout(for lack of a better term) is making his clients 10% via handicapping (That seems unrealistically high, but we will go with it).
let's assume he gets in 2 million worth of bets for the year on behalf of his clients and let's assume he gets 10% of that. That means he would be only making 20k for the year.

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year. Why would one want to give up 180k? I can understand if a guy is first starting out and he needs to build up a bankroll.

Red said himself, AP Sports betting dwarfs most other forms of AP because it's highly scalable. If you have had years of a proven track record, there's very little reason you would need or want investors for long since a meager bankroll should be growing year after year using Kelly.

There are probably some benefits to having investors beyond the freeroll aspect, but I highly doubt that would make up for that 90% you are giving up.

This is the last time I address you, Axel. You have very little idea what you are talking about. You keep saying "sports betting." Get it through your head -- for the most part, there is no "sports betting." It's not highly scalable. Figure out why -- hint: it's partly because (1) it ain't coin flips and (2) expertise is restricted to individual sports because, guess what, sports are completely different.

So that pretty much buries whatever naive perspective you bring to the table.

You know, I don't go around AP-splainin' blackjack to kewlJ or AP-splainin' video poker to Dancer or AP-splainin' any other games to you. But you think, and these other brain dead, arrogant alleged AP maroons, that you have cornered the market on overall gambling wisdom, when you inhabit your little individual crevices, involving not much money, with your college sophomore probability and wanderings around casinos.

Have you ever considered that maybe other people know specific things a lot more and a lot better than you do? Because if that ever dawns on you, maybe you can muster enough discipline to not pontificate when you have no idea what you're talking about.

Leonardo Da APs -- it's like a plague of lemmings.

What I really love about you guys is that the thread is titled "Professional Sports Betting." You have one poster who actually was a professional sports bettor, and every one of you "APs" thinks you know better than him. Have you ever considered the irony of that?

LOL. It's not like I haven't done it for 45 years and gotten rave reviews in the process. "Nooooooooo" as John Belushi used to say. I especially like "The Riddler" making money with every single project, and nobody mentions him. It's comical.

Have a good one.

[AxelWolf]

Or dial up "Anthony Curtis"

I asked you about this before. I don't think I got a proper response. I have known him for many years, I been to dinner with him,hung out with him, I have given him advice on different slot and VP plays, I played some of the same plays next to him, I went to his induction to the blackjack hall of fame party, I see him around from time to time. I have his number and he normally responds.

First off I know people in the public eye don't normally like to dis others, its not good for buissness, especially when you have somthing to promote or sell. He may not want to get involved.

I ask that you don't prep/ pre-coach him or alert him that I would be contacting him about you. I will ask him if that has happend.

Post up or send me a PM with whatever you deem appropriate to ask him, and please add that you want him to be honest, and that I have your permission to relay that information to others.

[kewlJ]

I see a fascinating dynamic at play here between mickey, axelwolf and Redietz. Most AP's are about winning money. Any notoriety or that we might get is usually through our handle or screen name and often times something we would rather not occur, because of our need for anonymity.

Red is completely different. We still haven't gotten any figures out of him about what kind of money he might have made. Just that he has been at it for 45 years. He is in it for the notoriety, hence all the name dropping and lists of publications that list a name that he claims was him.

He seems like an old guy standing on his porch screaming "I used to be someone" while the rest of the world goes on without him.

So here is my real question. Red not only doesn't try to hide who he is, which he rails against APs for, but I mean for years he posted his freaking address, like he wanted someone, anyone to look him up. When someone did, they discovered he lived in a very modest little house in the middle of nowhere, that he hadn't paid taxes on.

So if this guy is who he is or claiming to be, one of the top handicappers in the country for 45 years. What kind of money did he make and where is it? It doesn't show in his home. When he visits Vegas he does so on the cheap, budget end. He doesn't have kids he is leaving it to. Where is the freaking money or show me the money?

If he was who he says and made the kind of money you would have expected from a top sports handicapper for 45 year, you would have thought he would have bought a small condo or something in Vegas for the 100 days a year he spent in Vegas instead of staying in some of the weekly, run down places he has shared. Am I missing something?

[AxelWolf]

Why wouldn't they...aren't clients essentially a freeroll?

When it comes to investing clients one should only be getting a very small percentage, unless they are unethicly fleecing their clients. That wouldn't fit the narrative of Integrity Sports.

Let us assume a tout(for lack of a better term) is making his clients 10% via handicapping (That seems unrealistically high, but we will go with it).
let's assume he gets in 2 million worth of bets for the year on behalf of his clients and let's assume he gets 10% of that. That means he would be only making 20k for the year.

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year. Why would one want to give up 180k? I can understand if a guy is first starting out and he needs to build up a bankroll.

Red said himself, AP Sports betting dwarfs most other forms of AP because it's highly scalable. If you have had years of a proven track record, there's very little reason you would need or want investors for long since a meager bankroll should be growing year after year using Kelly.

There are probably some benefits to having investors beyond the freeroll aspect, but I highly doubt that would make up for that 90% you are giving up.

This is the last time I address you, Axel. You have very little idea what you are talking about. You keep saying "sports betting." Get it through your head -- for the most part, there is no "sports betting." It's not highly scalable. Figure out why -- hint: it's partly because (1) it ain't coin flips and (2) expertise is restricted to individual sports because, guess what, sports are completely different.

So that pretty much buries whatever naive perspective you bring to the table.

You know, I don't go around AP-splainin' blackjack to kewlJ or AP-splainin' video poker to Dancer or AP-splainin' any other games to you. But you think, and these other brain dead, arrogant alleged AP maroons, that you have cornered the market on overall gambling wisdom, when you inhabit your little individual crevices, involving not much money, with your college sophomore probability and wanderings around casinos.

Have you ever considered that maybe other people know specific things a lot more and a lot better than you do? Because if that ever dawns on you, maybe you can muster enough discipline to not pontificate when you have no idea what you're talking about.

Leonardo Da APs -- it's like a plague of lemmings.

What I really love about you guys is that the thread is titled "Professional Sports Betting." You have one poster who actually was a professional sports bettor, and every one of you "APs" thinks you know better than him. Have you ever considered the irony of that?

LOL. It's not like I haven't done it for 45 years and gotten rave reviews in the process. "Nooooooooo" as John Belushi used to say. I especially like "The Riddler" making money with every single project, and nobody mentions him. It's comical.

Have a good one.

I've never gone out of my way to get publicly noticed or mentioned like you have. For the most part, I've tried to go unnoticed and unmentioned. Unlike you, my ability to make money gambling doesn't require me to recruit investors.

[coach belly]

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year.

He can make 200K with or without investors, why would he need to give up 180K?

[AxelWolf]

Why wouldn't they...aren't clients essentially a freeroll?

When it comes to investing clients one should only be getting a very small percentage, unless they are unethicly fleecing their clients. That wouldn't fit the narrative of Integrity Sports.

Let us assume a tout(for lack of a better term) is making his clients 10% via handicapping (That seems unrealistically high, but we will go with it).
let's assume he gets in 2 million worth of bets for the year on behalf of his clients and let's assume he gets 10% of that. That means he would be only making 20k for the year.

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year. Why would one want to give up 180k? I can understand if a guy is first starting out and he needs to build up a bankroll.

Red said himself, AP Sports betting dwarfs most other forms of AP because it's highly scalable. If you have had years of a proven track record, there's very little reason you would need or want investors for long since a meager bankroll should be growing year after year using Kelly.

There are probably some benefits to having investors beyond the freeroll aspect, but I highly doubt that would make up for that 90% you are giving up.

This is the last time I address you, Axel. You have very little idea what you are talking about. You keep saying "sports betting." Get it through your head -- for the most part, there is no "sports betting." It's not highly scalable. Figure out why -- hint: it's partly because (1) it ain't coin flips and (2) expertise is restricted to individual sports because, guess what, sports are completely different.

So that pretty much buries whatever naive perspective you bring to the table.

You know, I don't go around AP-splainin' blackjack to kewlJ or AP-splainin' video poker to Dancer or AP-splainin' any other games to you. But you think, and these other brain dead, arrogant alleged AP maroons, that you have cornered the market on overall gambling wisdom, when you inhabit your little individual crevices, involving not much money, with your college sophomore probability and wanderings around casinos.

Have you ever considered that maybe other people know specific things a lot more and a lot better than you do? Because if that ever dawns on you, maybe you can muster enough discipline to not pontificate when you have no idea what you're talking about.

Leonardo Da APs -- it's like a plague of lemmings.

What I really love about you guys is that the thread is titled "Professional Sports Betting." You have one poster who actually was a professional sports bettor, and every one of you "APs" thinks you know better than him. Have you ever considered the irony of that?

LOL. It's not like I haven't done it for 45 years and gotten rave reviews in the process. "Nooooooooo" as John Belushi used to say. I especially like "The Riddler" making money with every single project, and nobody mentions him. It's comical.

Have a good one.

And, while you're at it since you seem to know Anthony Curtis(You will have to PM me since he doesn't know me by forum handle). He encouraged me to publish a book. When I told them one of the reasons I didn't want to was to protect the community and former teammates livelihoods who were still friends. I remember he told me that I should probably think about myself instead of protecting the community because the community isn't going to protect me and my pocketbook.

[coach belly]

I dont think they are paying per pick. I think they give/gave him money. He bets or has them bet and they give him a percentage of the wins.

I used one pick as an example...does there have to be more than one pick per season?

Wouldn't a 10K commission on one 100K winner qualify?

If you divide his total commission by the total number of picks, then you come up with an average commission per pick. That could end up being 10K per pick, even if it's more than one pick.

[AxelWolf]

Without investors, he would be making 200k per year.

He can make 200K with or without investors, why would he need to give up 180K?

You seem to know more about how his business model works and what he does. Why don't you explain it to me and we can go from there?

[coach belly]

Unlike you, my ability to make money gambling doesn't require me to recruit investors.

Don't you recruit team members? Can you make the same money whether you have a team or not?

Don't you collect commission on plays that you share?

Do the beneficiaries of your info ever bankroll their own play, or contribute to a team bankroll for a percentage of the team's win?

[coach belly]

Why don't you explain it to me and we can go from there?

First you explain why he would need to give up 180K, then I'll try to wise you up.

[AxelWolf]

I dont think they are paying per pick. I think they give/gave him money. He bets or has them bet and they give him a percentage of the wins.

I used one pick as an example...does there have to be more than one pick per season?

Wouldn't a 10K commission on one 100K winner qualify?

If you divide his total commission by the total number of picks, then you come up with an average commission per pick. That could end up being 10K per pick, even if it's more than one pick.

See the post above. It's not worth going over this until there's a better understanding of how his buissness model works and what role he plays in that.

Furthermore one would need to know what his average winning percentages are. I have no clue if he yields -3% or +10%.

[coach belly]

It's not worth going over this until there's a better understanding of how his buissness model works and what role he plays in that.

Nobody pushed you down that rabbit hole.

So try thinking outside the box, isn't that what you've recommended?

[MDawg]

Any notoriety or that we might get is usually through our handle or screen name and often times something we would rather not occur, because of our need for anonymity.

Is this gal for real? Quite clearly we have schizophrenic clashing forces at work in her twisted mind.

Really, it doesn't go much further than that anyone who claims to value anonymity so much wouldn't be so desperate to prove himself online, and yet also be unable to provide a shred of backup for anything he has had to say. Those conflicting values add up to a complete phony.