I want people to understand the context of me asking redietz about what kind of money he made. It isn't about a pissing contest over money "claimed". When a person says "professional gambler" or any of the labels Dietz has used or is now using, it implies a certain monetary level. No hard and fast rule, but what would be considered a living wage.
I like to say I have "supported myself from blackjack play" for 22 years now. But the first 3 years as a 20-22 year old were not much of a living wage, averaging 10k a year. If people want to disqualify those years, that is fair game. A lot of players go through that kind of period early on as you build a bankroll from scratch. But there has to be a point that when someone says, "professional this" or "making a living from that", that we are talking about some kind of real money.
I will go back to two specific incidents and people, that mislead in this manner.
* The second is the player that was a member here, Moses that passed a few years ago. When Moses burst onto the blackjack scene back on Norm's forum, he labeled himself as a professional blackjack player and sports bettor living and playing Reno. A number of people, myself included, had a problem with that because we knew it couldn't be....not in Reno.
So it turned out the person that posted as Moses, owned a successful business in California. Blinds or shades or something. When he divorced at about age 50, 12 years or so before he passed, he sold his business and moved to Reno. And this is when he began this blackjack and sports betting career. Nothing wrong with that. That is actually an ideal time to be involved with blackjack (I don't know about sports betting), to supplement retirement income...that sort of thing.
And on his deathbed, Moses confirmed that is basically what he did, when he stated he had made about 100k over 10 years. 10k a year supplementing retirement just does not give you the right to call yourself "professional anything". It is misleading.
* The first, prior to Moses there was another somewhat similar situation. Player called himself Flash, and later like redietz, upgraded to Zenmaster Flash. I am not going to say his real name, even though he is probably no longer with us because that is a "grey" or "Gray" area.
So this flash, similar to Moses retired early about age 50, from a teaching job at a university as a professor. A life-long gambler, who had interest in everything from horse-racing (big time) to roulette, craps and blackjack. So he took up card counting and blackjack at which he apparently was successful in playing at an advantage, even though he continues -Ev gambling at other things. So Flash took to mentoring new players and giving himself all sorts of fancy names and titles. By the time he was 70 and I knew him (in an online sense), he referred to himself as a 20 year professional gambler.
Towards the end of his time, like moses, Flash revealed some actual numbers. 300 and some thousand dollars won over those 20 years. So right off the bat you are talking 15ish grand a year.But it is even worse than that. One year he was involved with a hole-carding team that made good money. he says he made 150k that year. So if you subtract that one year out, over the other 19 of card counting he made less than 10k a year. That just is not a living wage that justifies calling yourself 20 year professional anything.
The guy was retired, with a retirement income and a wife still working. He was not a professional gambler or any other term you want to use. These are retired guys gambling, maybe playing at a little advantage making a few bucks.
Now Dietz was not retired, so how does this apply to him? It just doesn't appear from the numbers that he made much money from sports betting. Did he make good money as a "tout"? I have no idea. I don't know about that type of thing. But that is not what his claim was. His claim was "professional sports bettor", which now had morphed into "college football specialist". I would conclude a very similar misleading by Mr. Dietz all these years as to the other two blackjack players I mentioned. If you are going to call yourself a "professional" gambler, sports bettor, blackjack player, there HAS to be a monetary level involved that most people would consider a decent living wage.
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