Lol, its posts like these that keep me coming back to this siteQuote:
Originally Posted by theywontpayontuesday
Printable View
Lol, its posts like these that keep me coming back to this siteQuote:
Originally Posted by theywontpayontuesday
"...Huh? I thought YOU knew!"Quote:
Originally Posted by theywontpayontuesday
Some people on this forum are so damn hyper to disprove and argue something I have said....almost anything that I have said, that they distort all fact, claims and what was said.
The story Eliot shared about being called in to evaluate a high roller occurred in another country!
The Phil Ivy situation occurred in Atlantic City, where there are far different rules. They can't even back off and 86 players.
I have NEVER said "That is not the way Atlantic City works in regards to something". I have never said "that is not the way Macau or other countries work".
. What I have said is "What Mdawg claims is NOT the way Las Vegas works"
Las Vegas has a remedy available. They can just refuse a player for any reason, for no reason, without giving a reason. AND THEY DO. I have seen them back off/86 players playing blackjack that were no more counting cards as they were jumping over the moon. The player just happened to be winning, while varying wagers. Not even varying with the count....just varying.
Las Vegas just is not going to allow a player, playing rated so they have a clear record if he is winning, to play and win hundreds of days a year for years and years, in the amounts Mdawg claims. Just not going to happen in Las Vegas, let alone at one of the sweatiest strip casinos, where he claims much of this fantasy took place.
I know it irritates some of you people, but I KNOW how Las Vegas works. ESPECIALLY TABLE GAME PLAY! I have been a successful card counter/Ap in Las Vegas for 16 years. It is my business to know how things work, what a player can and can't do and get away with. AND how to keep being able to play...be welcome back to play. THAT is what I have specialized in.
Mdawg claiming he won millions of dollars, playing rated, for hundreds of days a years, 6 or 7 straight years now, in Las Vegas, just is not real. It is a fantasy. It is NOT how Las Vegas operates. And you people trying to distort and change fact and point to incidents in other parts of the world or country, are just grasping as much as he is. That is NOT what we are talking about. We are talking about Las Vegas and Mdawgs claims are NOT the way Las Vegas works. Period. These claims have always just been fantasy. The title of his thread invokes fantasy and from his very first post where he posted pictures of casino chips and cash on a bed, trying to claim that meant he had won....it was ALL fantasy.
Mdawgs claims are as real as Singer's Newell, or Singers Million dollar hit on a computer screen in his daughters house. PERIOD! And any real players that play Vegas knows it. Funny, you don't see any real players that play Vegas for a living, especially table game players suggesting that I am wrong do you?
Dawg has come up with a whole array of explanations for how he has been able to win. Everything from voodoo things like "betting into hot streaks", to counting cards at blackjack, to claims of knowing the first card out (hole-carding) to one time he suggested loss rebates, even though he never posts about losses (so that didn't work). His latest and one he has stuck with for a while is that he is rainman.
Come on people! :rolleyes:
There are ways that he could have given himself an advantage and won long term. he hasn't hit on any yet as his explanation, but there are ways.
BUT as I have discussed, finding something mathematical that gives the player an advantage is only part of the equation. It is only half the battle. Not EVEN HALF.
The second and much harder part is finding ways and developing a style of play that will allow you to keep playing and again, especially at table games AP.
THIS is the hard part. Longevity. This is the reason there are so many former professional blackjack players running boot camps and seminars, because they failed at that second part. :rolleyes:
You MUST understand how Las Vegas works, what a player can and can't do to even begin to figure out how to get your play down for a long period and Mdawg and apparently some of you trying to twist things around for him, just haven't no such understanding.
Pit people in the high limit rooms would lose their jobs if they allowed even a fraction of what Dawg claims to have occurred.
You know, the very same people he claims are patting him on the back and cheering him on. THEY WOULD LOSE THEIR JOBS!
And these aren't novice, newer pit people. The most experienced and best the casino have work the high limit rooms. They have seen it all and know it all. And they would NEVER allow what Dawg is claiming to occur.
This is precisely one of the reasons why REAL APs and long-term winning players avoid high limit rooms and tables. Avoid them like the plague.
A few here claim to believe Mslob, but only because they hate you, or homos in general......however anyone with even 1/2 a brain (coach belly is disqualified) knows he`s a lying sack of Saudi shitQuote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Mdawg is a guy that owns or is associated with a forum for writer's writing stories.
And he likes to gamble, has some money, so can afford to gamble. And likes the comps casinos offer to higher limit losing players.
At some point he decided to combine these two things he likes and write stories about gambling.
And everything fits, everything works except for the winning. That is made up. Everything else is just how things really work, all the freebies and comps and royal treatment. But that treatment is reserved for losing players not long-term winning players playing at an advantage.
If you take away all the ridiculous claims of winning everything about his adventure works....just the way Las Vegas works. But you add in the winning and none of it works or fits. It just all becomes fantasy!
I don't for the life of me, know why he thought he could pull this silliness off on forums populated by real winning players, some of whom play for a living. :confused:
When the book cuts off the beard you send in a different beard. Walters ran thru hundreds of them, including redietz. If you want all these answers read Walters book. He explains it in detail. Also his interview in Gambling Wizards is good.Quote:
Originally Posted by coach bellyHow was the 3 mil bet split up? Three hundred separate 10 thousand dollar bets?Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Did the books permitted the beards to win consistently, and continue to bet?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmWhen the book cuts off the beard you send in a different beard. Walters ran thru hundreds of them, including redietz. If you want all these answers read Walters book. He explains it in detail. Also his interview in Gambling Wizards is good.Quote:
Originally Posted by coach bellyHow was the 3 mil bet split up? Three hundred separate 10 thousand dollar bets?Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Did the books permitted the beards to win consistently, and continue to bet?
I realize it helps your fictional take on me to say I was a runner, but it's such a silly, blatant and provable lie that it's beneath you. Really. When you throw around blatant lies and declare them as truths, and those lies are easily debunked, it fucks up everyone's perception of you. And eventually everyone's memory of you. You realize, mickey, if Munchkin reads these posts of yours, he will realize you are bullshitting about me for no good reason, and that this kind of fairy tale stuff will cast doubt on all of your stories and your entire self-presentation.
Hopefully, Munchkin doesn't read this nonsense, because of all the silly lies you could tell, this one is the easiest to demonstrate as a lie. If you do not know why, sorry, my friend, I'm not going to help you.
On top of all this, you have a very naive view about many of these topics. Most of your opinions vis-a-vis sports betting are vanilla, silly, or both.
God bless.
God bless Tiny Tim.
Right there is the problem. Belly doesn't really want these answers. he and the people like him on this forum that twist everything up, already know the answers. They just lie and twist and distort everything in some trollish effort to support something or someone that they know is not true. THAT is what trolling is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
The interesting thing to me is to figure out why these people do this with shit they know is not true. The majority, like Singer, and dawg and others are just anti-AP. They are long-term losing players that are jealous and bitter of players that can and do win.
And Belly probably also falls into this category. But there is something a little bit different about Belly. It is his support for players claims that he knows are not true and endorsement of gambling voodoo shit that he KNOWS is not true. That is what made me think very early on, and still do that it is more than just trolling and being contrarian. I think he is associated with the casino industry. If not him, someone in his family and he wants to push this narrative that AP's aren't real and don't really win but all the voodoo winning shit (long disproven) does work.
But in the end, I have given up trying to figure what the bug up his ass is about. better just to ignore him completely.
How long did the baccarat player stay ahead compared to mdawg?Quote:
Originally Posted by coach bellyThe length or number of trips is irrelevant. The sample size is the number of outcomes, not days stayed, or days played, or sessions played or whatever you are claiming.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
As far as you know, the total number of hands that Jacobson's big player experienced during his run was nearly equal to or greater than what MDawg has played.
Do you know how many hands that either Jacobson's player or MDawg have played?
I recall that Jacobson posted his big player story to specifically refute your assertion that a casino would not allow a player to win consistently over a long period of time, and would certainly not comp a player who consistently wins big at high limit table games.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
We know that the casino relies on the math to win overall at table games, but they don't need for every player to lose for that to happen.
We also know that some players do win, while the casino also wins. Those results are not mutually exclusive.
You either believe that MDawg has played with an advantage (and the casinos haven't figured out what it is) or you don't, and think he has relied entirely on luck...just like Jacobson's player did.
Which is it...which do you believe?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Yes, if Munchkin read your bullshit here about how computer betting and multi-accounting don't work, which he came out of retirement to pursue, I'm sure he would definitely be amused. But further than that he would be laughing all the way to the bank with the money he makes doing it.Quote:
Originally Posted by redietz
Why don't you quiz Munchkin on his computer betting and multi-accounting and relay the information to us. That is, if you can be honest about it.
Higher limit results distort everything.
Lets say a player makes 10 trips over a 3 year period. He wins 8 of those trips and betting $100 per hands is ahead $3000 at the end of the 3 years and 10 trips. Nobody would think anything of it. He is ahead 30 times his bet. Probably on the outer edge of standard deviation, but very possible. Nothing all that special.
Now bump up his bet from $100 to $200,000. He is ahead 6 million. The same 30 times bet. A casino is probably going to be more concerned and call in an expert like Eliot, who will conclude that it is the very same outer edge of standard deviation, but still very possible. Just nothing all that special.
THAT is all the Eliot situation was. A casinos really shouldn't have to do that. They should have people in their employ that would know that. But with large amounts if they want to call in a second expert opinion for their own piece of mind, good for them.
And by the way, a gambling expert mathematician is not the ONLY expert that would be called in to such a situation as Eliot was. Expert advantage play consultants (if none on staff) would also be called in to try to determine if the player was doing anything at an advantage.
Maybe you would call the math expert first and then the advantage play expert (also looking at cheating). I don't know. But they would cover all bases.
And again, if we go back to the Mdawg "stories", after 6 years hundreds and hundreds of days played and upwards of 10 million claimed that he won, people would have been called in. They just wouldn't sit back and allow a player to win like he claims.
And guess what? The final piece to the puzzle is that if they can't figure out how a player is winning....lets say some new advantage play technique that the casino experts just can't figure out...they STILL will put an end to it. They just do not allow a player to do and win what Mdawg claims.
I mean what do you think, casinos just throw up their hands and say "I don't know how he is winning, so just let him keep winning and clean us out?"
Come on people...stop with this silliness. This shit is just NOT how Las Vegas works. :D I don't know why some of you are pretending it is, when you damn well know better. This is what is entertainment to you. Fantasy stories that defy how things work (reality)?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmYes, if Munchkin read your bullshit here about how computer betting and multi-accounting don't work, which he came out of retirement to pursue, I'm sure he would definitely be amused. But further than that he would be laughing all the way to the bank with the money he makes doing it.Quote:
Originally Posted by redietz
Why don't you quiz Munchkin on his computer betting and multi-accounting and relay the information to us. That is, if you can be honest about it.
I have no issue with people multi-accounting except for the fact that they damage the bonuses of real players in the long run. It's as simple as that. I also have no issue, as I stated here and in person, with people using multi-accounting not to exploit bonuses but to circumvent limits. I have no issue with that, and frankly that seems like the best use of multi-accounting to me.
Plus there is the problem, as Munchkin mentioned during one lunch, that a sports book, even an onshore, "legit," major-company book can and will freeze your accounts if they decide you have been multi-accounting to exploit bonuses. It seems like a terrible misuse of their power, but the fact is, in the fine print, they hang onto the allegedly legal ability to do just that if they decide you are multi-accounting. And I'm sure lawsuits ensue, and good luck to everyone with that.
Now please continue to explain how I was a runner for Mr. Walters. I'm sure you have some fine evidence, or lacking that, some really insightful observations of how I did it. Inquiring minds, mickey, want to know about your declarations. Or be a good honest Christian and explain that you were making it all up.
This is true. BUT that is NOT what your gripe was. You repeatedly said stupid shit like anyone using multiple accounts was I believe you said "stealing" form friends and relatives. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by redietz
Of course books can freeze your account. Or not honor bonuses or any number of other restrictions. I have had one of these things (not honoring bonus after the fact) happen to me. We don't like it, but that is part of the "game".Quote:
Originally Posted by redietz
And it happens exactly the same way in other areas of advantage play. Casinos are always trying to stop or limit winning players. Always. And the AP and winning players have to figure out new ways around these things. In blackjack this has always been referred to as the "cat & mouse game", but it is a little more vicious than that. It is more like a war. A good AP/player figures way around each and every obstacle thrown at him or moves on to something with less obstacles at the moment.
THAT is what AP is about. No one is handing anything to you. You have to work to take it. That is what I have been trying to impress on this forum for a very long time. The math is really the smaller part of advantage play.
And that is why it is irritating and insulting to real players that fight this war and figure ways around obstacles to have some nit wit come along claiming he wins every day, and that the casinos don't care and love him for it and take no counter-measures. It is fantasy. He might as well be saying he flaps his arms and flys around the moon.
If their experts can't identify any advantage play technique, then they will let them play.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Eliot Jacobson posted his big player story to refute the assertion that you made above, and below...
Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by teliot
Does another syndicate bettor need to publish his story in order to use the same betting protocols (multiple books, runners, etc) as Walters?Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Dietz, YOU have mentioned "provable" responding to mickeycrimm, multiple times now. I generally don't ask for proof, but if you are volunteering.....:rolleyes:
You have some sort of relationship with Munchkin. You claim you worked for Bllly Walters, not as a runner, but some valued part of his organization that he looked to for advice.
So how about you call on these two people you claim to have or had a relationship with, arrange for some kind of interview or Q & A and lets get to the bottom of this? :confused:
Instead of you continuing to reference and play games with a podcast that you know is NEVER going to happen.
If you really wanted to get to the bottom of this, it would have been done long ago. :cool: